Why is BART based in Oakland anyway?
I'm retired now, but have always wondered why is BART based in Oakland, the most crime-ridden city in the Bay Area? It seems to be putting employees in a lot of unnecessary danger.
Someone was shot outside of the BofA at 300 Lakeside within the first week of when BART moved its offices there. Sunday, a prospective google employee was murdered at 19th and Webster, a block away. People are mugged all the time downtown. I started driving to work rather than have to walk the two blocks from BART to the office.
Is there some sort of deal that BART must remain in Oakland? It seems that, other than Clorox, most companies have fled Oakland but government companies and agencies stay. Is there some kind of deal? Would moving BART headquarters to a safer location be politically incorrect? I'd like to go have lunch with some of my old co-workers but with snipers and shooters and rioters why take the chance?
I've lived in Oakland for 15
I've lived in Oakland for 15 years. And...somebody upstairs must like me, because nobody has ever bothered me since I moved here.
Great question. It is
Great question.
It is definitely not a safe area at night.
IIRC, BART's first
IIRC, BART's first headquarters or administrative offices was in San Francisco (Mission & 4th St. - perhaps someone can confirm this). Being the first transit operation running automatically by computers, it was decided that the computer, control center and administrative offices be located at one central location. The least expensive piece of land was space over a designated station (12th, 19th and MacArthur Stations were not suited back in 1970) so the Lake Merritt BART station was the ideal choice. It was situated on one of the triangular branches (Wye - "Y") so computer command and control systems could be wired directly onto the right-of-way. The idea of remote servers was only a reality of NASA at the time. The Lake Merritt BART offices was from early reports a very inefficient piece of property - a 5 story building that was more for post-card photos than to operate a transit agency. Engineering, purchasing, warehouses, and design departments quickly were cast out to far flung downtown Oakland office buildings - Human Resources was located on San Pablo Ave near 15th(?), engineering in an office building originally designed as a hotel, and some further consolidation at 14th and Broadway. It was only in the early 2000's that BART accepted a deal as an anchor tenant at the Kaiser Building - after the previous anchor tenant - University of California Systemwide moved into their own headquarters at 11th and Franklin. As many know, BART decided around 2005 to remove, actually deconstruct the Lake Merritt building because it interferred with the earthquake retrofit of the BART station, leaving the computer center and control room intact below grade. BART will be at the Kaiser Center for a while.
Much of the history of BART can be found at the main Oakland Public Library.
Downtown Oakland is a great
Downtown Oakland is a great area with many new (and remodeled) theaters, restaurants, upscale bars, and clubs, not to mention Oakland's successful 10K residents plan, which has seen thousands of new residents moving into new condominiums throughout the downtown area. The area immediately north of downtown (along Broadway and Telegraph) is blossoming into a hip new arts district, complete with galleries, studios, and coffee shops. Most of the violent crime in downtown is constrained to the Lakeside apartments district, which admittedly isn't the greatest, but where BART's offices are located is hardly unsafe, even at night. Many large companies are headquartered here, as I'm sure you must know, such as Kaiser, Ask.com, Dreyer's, and several privately-held technology and logistics firms.
LOL. Yeah, how about that
LOL.
Yeah, how about that Jack London Square development that was supposed to "revitalize" the area?
Retailers are fleeing like rats from a sinking ship.
Ask.com is still in business??
Gruntled, maybe you shouldn't
Gruntled, maybe you shouldn't leave the house at all. It's just a big, scary world out there. Us Oaklanders will enjoy the food, art and culture that is making this a great city, while you stay hidden under the covers in your sterile suburb.
Amen!
Amen!
http://www.cityrating.com/cit
http://www.cityrating.com/citycrime.asp?city=Oakland&state=CA
Murder Is 3.50 times the National Average
Oakland does have some very
Oakland does have some very violent neighborhoods, fortunately, Downtown isn't one of them. Neither is the Piedmont, Lakeshore, Rockridge or Montclair neighborhoods. In fact, if you looked at crime by zip code, I'm sure you'd find that the majority of violent crimes are in East Oakland, south of Fruitvale. If you hang out there enough, you're probably likely to encounter some crime. The original poster points out 2 violent crimes occurring in Downtown over the course of 5 years - the most recent of which happened after midnight on a Sunday in an area that is extremely deserted at that time (19th and Webster). Sounds pretty minimal for an area that attracts over 80,000 people for work each day, plus several thousand residents. The great thing about all of the new bars and restaurants opening Downtown and Uptown is that there are eyes and ears on the streets until late at night and greatly add to the area's safety. If you walk around the area during the day and feel unsafe, then you need to look in the mirror and decide why you're so paranoid, as I'd guess that the majority of Downtown employees are not scared to walk to BART or grab a sandwich at lunch, as they do it everyday. Lots of them even seem to enjoy themselves!
Until 2008 I worked in one of
Until 2008 I worked in one of the auto dealerships on Broadway. Going east towards Webster
and Franklin is exactly as you describe--upscale and full of professional-looking people.
Go to the west towards Telegraph though, and the ghetto is just a block away. By the time
you get to San Pablo it looks like the killing fields @ 73rd and Bancroft, complete with
hookers, gangbangers and thugs.
The other one to watch is Rockridge--people there seem to think they're in Montclair. Take
a look around folks; Oakland Tech just ain't that far away.
A useful tool probably
A useful tool probably familiar to many is Oakland Crimespotting. You can break down crimes by date, type, and even hour (e.g., night vs. day). While all of the city falls victim to property crime, places like Rockridge have almost no violent crime. Downtown Oakland mostly only sees violent crime (Aggravated Assault, Robbery, Homicide) at night, and that too in just few hotspots, like the Lakeside district and 12th St BART station. It's best not to live in fear!
It's best not to live in
It's best not to live in Oakland.
Which sunny garden spots do
Which sunny garden spots do you prefer in the Bay? Everywhere is a trade.
Well, Dublin, Pleasanton,
Well, Dublin, Pleasanton, Walnut Creek, Alamo and Danville all come to mind. Houses there
really don't cost as much as property in the Oakland Hills. What are the residents of these
places trading for?
There's a reason the Outer
There's a reason the Outer East Bay is cheaper. For one thing, you are miles away from hundreds of top California restaurants and bars representing the cuisines and drinks of the world, including Michelin starred restaurants and nationally known jazz clubs, renowned museums, top live performance venues, and the diversity of the many ideas and peoples of the Bay. You're nearer the City and its myriad cultural events and renowned institutions. Aside from long BART rides (if you're lucky) for work or pleasure, you're largely tied to a car-dependent, climate-change inducing lifestyle, including the bone-crushing traffic of 680, 24, and 580. You're forced to endure some of the widest seasonal climate shifts in the Bay, including scorching hot summer highs with cool nights sometimes featuring a forty degree temperature shift. You are confined to largely uninspiring architecture and landscape as compared to the heritage of the California craftsman and Victorian buildings throughout the inner east bay and its sweeping views of the Bay and its bridges. Even the question of schools is somewhat of a toss-up: while many outer East Bay schools are quite strong, the best schools in the Bay (in the top 100 nationally) are in Piedmont, San Francisco (Lowell), and Fremont (Mission San Jose). Even Oakland Tech, so disparaged above, has been known for having the largest number of women students matriculate at MIT out of all high schools. Oakland's small schools initiative has successfully transformed underperforming schools in less fortunate areas into neighborhood learning centers, attracting students that live nearby rather and the involvement of their parents. Of course, it is understandable that while someone living in Oakland might like to BART over for some of the Bay's best Mexican cuisine in Fruitvale on International, it might not be the place for a family of four to drive to for a dinner out. Of course there's a trade.
Nice copy/paste of a press
Nice copy/paste of a press release.
I like my car. Driving is fun. Freeways in this area aren't even remotely as bad as carless schmucks like to pretend. If it ain't rush hour they're usually sailing along.
Most of Oakland's schools are hellholes. I know, because several of my friends tried teaching in them only to burn out and move out of the bay area after just a couple years.
Oakland has nice neighborhoods... if you can afford them! Dollar for dollar the quality of life is much higher OUTSIDE of Oakland than it is in it.
Oh yes, it must be nice
Oh yes, it must be nice driving in a 55 mile per gallon car. Maybe your friends should try teaching in suburbia?
What the hell are you talking
What the hell are you talking about?
miramonte in orinda and
miramonte in orinda and campolindo in moraga are also in the top 100...
areas like diablo (danville), once the playground of the rich and famous, has "heritage of the California craftsman"
i'm sure i could poke holes in the rest of your statement, but i don't feel like doing any research right now and those are just the ones i know off the top of my head.
Ooh thanks for the link to
Ooh thanks for the link to the pretty map. I'm a fan!
No matter where you are in
No matter where you are in Oakland you are a quick 5 minute drive away for a thug with a gun and nothing to lose.
If you feel safe living somewhere like that, fine. But stop pretending there isn't a problem when there clearly is.
One could say that about any
One could say that about any urban region in the U.S. If anything deters people from living in an area like Piedmont, it's the cost, not proximity to West Oakland.
No one's denying there's a
No one's denying there's a crime problem in Oakland. But you make it seem like its Somalia where everyone including the children are packing heat and there's someone waiting to kill you out on every corner. If you think San Francisco is devoid of crime just ride the T Third going to Bayview. Once you go south of Mission Bay especially during night you enter some very violent neighborhoods especially around the Cow Palace. The mission isn't safe either during the night. Hell someone got killed in a drive by shooting in North Beach a few months ago. And someone was killed during Pink Saturday in the Castro this year.
I guess it's better than
I guess it's better than Richmond!
[quote]The original poster
[quote]The original poster points out 2 violent crimes occurring in Downtown over the course of 5 years ... Sounds pretty minimal ...[/quote]
Not really. Most professionals I know go though their entire working careers without ANYONE being murdered near their workplaces, ESPECIALLY right in front of their workplace in the middle of the day.
LOL
LOL
Working in the suburbs sucks
Working in the suburbs sucks though.
so does getting shot
so does getting shot
OMG, Bart headquarters is in
OMG, Bart headquarters is in the killing fields!
Though things happen rather infrequently, the uptown neighborhood is really reasonably safe during business hours and not all that unsafe in the evening. I work very near the Kaiser building and I see it everyday. Yes, west to Telegraph and San Pablo is worse, but contrary to popular belief there are a lot of businesses here which the other poster pointed out, so I won't repeat them. Land is cheaper than San Francisco, so that's probably why.
If you like your suburb then enjoy it, but is sounds like you really don't know Oakland much at all if you think this is a bad neighborhood (or have read too many hyped news stories).
The entire bay area is like swiss cheese with pockets of crime, even in the supposedly crime-free suburbs. I understand Concord and Pittsburg/Bay Point aren't so great in some parts and there were some drug killings out there too. I'd consider a lot of neighborhoods in the bay area worse than uptown where BART is. Even in very wealthy areas there is always a pocket of worse neighborhoods nearby. Crime is mobile and if you live near a freeway or bart track it might come near you, too.
The last state I lived in was overall much safer than California, so maybe you should consider moving out of the state if you're really so concerned about crime.
I love how half of these
I love how half of these posters pretend that crime doesn't exist in small cities and/or suburbs.
Take into account my former hometown, Methford (oh wait, I mean Medford) Oregon, a small town of 70,000 people where all of California retires to for whatever reason. In the last two months there has been 4 near-fatal shootings directly attributed to a meth or drug trade going down bad. This doesn't count death or near-death of violent offenders getting shot by vigilantes out in the boonies, those don't make the papers usually (usually because no one finds out until they find his body in the river a year later). And yes, that's right, we have guns out in the sticks!
Funny thing is that the public transit is safer than driving, seeing that carjackings have become quite common there. Hmm, how peculiar this world is we live in! Just offering this for a second perspective.
I love how you go out of your
I love how you go out of your way to pick a "small city" that has abnormally high crime rates.