BUMS on the morning Pittsburg/Baypoint line

So this morning for the second day in a row, the cars are full of stinky BUMS laying all of the seats smelling up the cars. Moving from one car to the next, more BUMS! Of course I called the train operator to report this like so many people say on these forums to GET INVOLVED. Operator exclaims, Bums? (like he has no clue what I am saying). I tell him don't you guys sweep these trains for vagrants with no tickets and no money? He of course tells me that as long as they have a ticket, they are entitled to ride the trains. What a freaking joke, I didn't know a $1.10 ticket (if they even had that) entitled you to stink up the system all day long while you lay on two seats riding from Pittsburg to Daly City all day long. What can be done about this???? Apparently the useless train operator who works his ass off sitting on his brain all day long has no solutions.

This is a tough call. If they do have a ticket it would be hard to argue they should have to get off. Even bums have to travel now and then and BART is public transportation. The problem is that they are abusing it and we all have to suffer. Which is a huge drag. I really don't think that much can be done other than the police maybe checking them out to see if they are sober/high or not.

Why don't then the BART police wake them up and check to see A.) if they even have a valid ticket with enough fare to get off the train or B.) do they have any money to add fare if their ticket is only $1.10

I am sorry, you are NOT entitled to ride back and forth all day long stinking up the place cause you have no place else to go. My fare dollars are paying for fumigating those seats after smelly person abuses them.

bartside's picture

Hell ya, if this the bum's ticket only has $1.10 per say, then wouldn't it be strange that he's at a station that costs more than his ticket's value?

They are the main reason our trains stink so bad but Bart isn't doing anything about it.

bartside

That's true, they should be checking these guys.
I guess if you were a terrorist, dressing as a bum would be good cover since they
are never bothered and people, including the police and operators, turn a blind eye
to them.

Keep in mind... Just because someone looks like a bum does not automatically mean they are not a paying customer. The cops shouldn't discrimiate or stereotype these people for these reasons. Hundreds of people sleep on the trains, and sleeping on the trains is not illegal. Making a train car your temporary or permanent residence, IS illegal. BART cops can't cite someone for taking up two seats, or putting their feet on the seats, UNLESS the person is deemed to be blocking free movement.

As for your comment about them never being bothered... I don't expect that you ride EVERT SINGLE train that runs throughout the system, so your statement is not necessisarily accurate. I have seen the BART cops contact sleepers before and one time they even took the guy off the train, probably because he didn't have a ticket.

hey ass-clown, if it looks like a bum, and smells like a bum, 99.99% of the time it is a f*cking bum!!!! You are obviously some bleeding heart liberal who is more interested in protecting the rights of the dregs of society. Go work in a soup kitchen or hand out blankets to the homeless, but don't tell me I don't know what a fucking bum look like.

Even a bum has rights.. And odor is unfortunatly not enough to question someone.

yes, it is; i've been on the train when they stink up an entire car; take their shoes off and put their nasty ass feet on the seats. they are absolutely gross and a total health issue. i think the health department would have something to say about these offensive people and their more offensive smells. BART is not the homeless hotel.

not when they are fare evading ass-clown

We all know that the homeless ride on BART for shelter, sleep, panhandle, etc. They are not on their way to work, a business meeting or to visit Aunt May out in the burbs. Yes BART Police could check for tickets and if in violation of the law eject them from the system. However, let us say that they are contacted outside of San Francisco (you know, where they all originated from). Perhaps one of the affluent communities of Orinda or insert your city. Do you really want BART Police to eject them from the system so they are free to roam and stink up your city? Should they be taken to jail and if so for what...lodging on a train? Do you actually think a judge would find a homeless person guilty of lodging on a BART train? It's not going to happen. I have not seen it yet.

The only way to effectively respond to this problem (on a BART level) is to remove them from the trains while they are in San Francisco. That is why the police out in the burbs do not bother dealing with it "out there" because they would just be passing along the problem to someone else. So, what do you do? You remove them when they are back in the City. After all, San Francisco and all of the bleeding hearted politicians and supporters who live there are responsible for the mess. Thanks guys!

Now, since most of these people are in poor health, it requires a little time to offboard them. So you won't mind if your train is held up downtown for a few minutes while they are removed right? Yah right. That's what I thought.

So you see there is no simple solution to the problem. Well, unless you ask me.....

Uh, have you seen all the homeless around Concord and Pittsburg BART Stations? They are everywhere and they originate from everywhere, not just from SF, but Oakland, Concord, Pittsburg too. I see homeless driving their carts around Walnut Creek and Lafayette as well.

By way, wonder why the police hasn't done something to clean up the total mass of homeless between MacArthur and Broadway that are camping out under the freeway overpass there? The mess they've made is just incredibly gross. LItter and stuff everywhere. There must be like 30 of them living there. I just love watching some homeless take a dump outside my train window. I also feel sorry for their animals.

If it's flop-able, it's Bsrt-able!

California penal code 647j prohibits lodging on public or private property (including vehicles such as BART trains). BART police officers can articulate this crime if they see someone sprawled out across the seats, with a pillow, their shoes off, blankets, etc. This is especially obvious when someone rolls into an end of the line station and stays on the train. If it can be determined that the passenger's sole purpose for being on the train is to lodge, they can be cited for this violation (a misdemeanor, by the way).

BART police officers are also authorized to check any passenger's ticket at any time while within the paid area (stations, trains, platforms). This can be done without probable cause, or even reasonable suspicion. If the officer doubts the validity of the ticket, the passenger can be off-boarded to have the ticket checked by a station agent.

Some people who lodge on the trains often do not have tickets and can be cited for fare evasion and ejected from the system upon determination by the officer.

Also, even if the person did have a ticket, once a BART ticket is processed to enter at a station, it is typically only valid for up to three hours. It is expected that one trip should be completed in no more than 3 hours. After three hours, the ticket is no longer valid and will cause the fare gates to beep and read "See Agent" when someone attempts to process it out.

I wish this was posted on the train itself and enforced by BART Police religiously. It isn't fair that passengers should have to put up with this. Absolutely disgusting and just nauseating to have to endure the smell of them.

that is good stuff. So after 3 hours when you try to exit it will expire. Good to know in case I accidentally fall asleep and end up on the train for over 3 hours. You never know, I might be out partying too late and fall asleep in my morning commute!

These bums also take up two seats during peak commute hours cuz they are such nice considerate bums.

I've heard operators call into Central reports from passengers of other passengers (bums?) smelling up the cars. Central usually says well there's no law against that but we'll send BART police to do a welfare check. If the bum, er I mean domicile challenged person has a ticket they don't do a damn thing about it. I can remember years ago when I was an Agent, the police would sweep the trains leaving the city at Embarcadero and kick all the homeless people off the train. Then of course they'd all come upstairs, without tickets and I have to deal with them. I don't know what the solution is but something should be done.

It's too bad the station agents get stuck with them too; they should be escorted by BART Police right out of the system. BART Police need to resume kicking them off the trains.

We shouldn't just be kicking them off the trains -- we should be kicking them out of the bay area. Seriously, instead of giving them handouts why not build a big homeless shelter way out in the central valley somewhere where land is cheap. Then we could outlaw vagrancy, and on the third offense ship them out there. If they come back, I am in favor of Sam Kinison's suggestion.

don't send them money or food, send them U-Hauls? (because the desert is sand, and in 100 years it will still be sand)

ok, first of all, i don't think the author actually meant $1.10. second of all, WHO THE HELL CARES?

Why do birds suddenly appear, anytime you are near?

R. Doyle